a rare public entry....

[tiggz]

okay...so apparently i missed quite a bit today. i was kept abreast of it by my wonderful ant, however.

it all started with a simple entry Cashmere made in her livejournal. just her expressing her dislike of negativity at the beta and camp. she then mentioned that she felt like one particular poster was responsible for a vast majority of the negativity. this is when all hell broke loose.

since the entry was public a few people decided to call her on her comment about said person. told her she was childish and two-faced etc etc. keep in mind that this was posted in her lj. friends only or not she has the right to vent about people she doesn't like or just doesn't see eye to eye with.

anyway...point is people continue to amaze me. i've reiterated time and time again in my journal and in other people's journal that the entire point of lj is to write about your feelings and thoughts. it's definitely okay for someone to comment on it if the comments feature is left enabled. however, coming into someone's journal and attacking them is deplorable. if you don't agree with the person's outlook, so be it. not everyone likes the same people. it's the way the world turns. get over it.

if someone is trashing a friend, it's perfectly justified for you to ask them how they came about their conclusion that this person is an asshole. it's not okay to cop an attitude and tell the person they're wrong for the way they feel. it's bullshit and i'm not going to stand for it happening to me or my friends.

ant was absolutely correct with his posts in Cash's livejournal. a lot of campers are incredibly hypocritical. i've said it before and i'll probably say it again. it's perfectly fine for them to air their personal feelings about people they don't like, but if someone says something about one of their own there will be hell to pay. *shakes head* there's also a holier than thou attitude with a lot of campers. it drives me absolutely insane. i'm not one to hold my tongue either. if i don't like you, i'm sure you already know. if not, buy a clue.

it makes me incredibly angry that because of all this shit, Cashmere has decided to delete her lj. it's bullshit, pure and simple. no one has the right to tell you that your feelings or thoughts are wrong.

so...if you're lurking and reading this, i hope you realize how hypocritical and ridiculous you are. maybe then you'll do something to change your behaviour.

fucking people...

Comments

[princeoflunacy.livejournal.com]

Quite a few points to make on that post...

Firstly I TOTALLY agree that someone's journal is there for them to post their thoughts and feelings....I kind of did already tonight,and I am certain there will be a time when i comment on individual people who piss me off.

However by the same token I think people have the right,like you say to comment if its not disabled. To attack is wrong I agree,but its how you perceive it. I've seen the comments,and well to be honest the jury is still out. I'm just not sure whether I see one particular comment as an attack or whether it's a situation that just escalated out of control. Because let's face it,that does happen.

I am actually dissappointed myself that Cashmere deleted her lj. Leaving a board or two is one thing,heck you know how I love to do that*g*,but your lj is your lj! I am so pissed she felt she had to do this....for her sake!

Now...the holier than thou attitude at the camp? Yeah,it's there,not always but it raises its head from time to time. One of the reasons I only lasted three days in it the last time. However similar negativities exist at the Beta. They are just a bit more subtle.(until it comes to banning people*g*)

As for whether ant was right or not,the sad thing is I dont think ANYONE was right in the situation.....not saying they were wrong either! I know this sounds like a cop out but I really just think the situation got out of control.

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

john i agree with you to an extent, but let's face it. the people who made the stink in Cash's journal were doing so because they felt the need to smack her down for daring to voice an opinion contrary to their's.

that's what it all boils down to.

[jj-2000.livejournal.com]

*applauds* YAY! I couldn't have said it better myself.

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

thanks, jen. :D

[foxant10.livejournal.com]

the situation, as i saw it, was more in regards to the principle of privacy. who cares if the comment feature is on or not. it's her journal.

i posted this analogy to allyson, but she had her opinion which i'll share later. i said, if someone you know of forgetfully leaves their journal on a table in the cafeteria.

do you read it and make snide remarks at what she wrote in her journal?

do you read it, don't comment on it and return it?

do you not read it and return it?

it's up to our own individual character to choose which path we take. i would choose the third one because it is not my place to read someone's journal.

now comes allyson's opinion. is a live journal a journal or a postingboard? i say journal. she says postingboard. i feel that the "friends" list put up gives those on the list the freedom to comment whether the entry is open to the public or not. i also feel that if an entry is open to the public that doesn't give every tom, dick and harry the right to come into the entry and start posting shit. there's an ettiquete to this place and people "coming off the street" to demean you in your own journal is disgusting.

as i see it, what cashmere did was right because she was expressing her feelings. do i agree with her expression? yes, as a matter of fact i do. telling someone to their face that their negative bullshit is infecting their posting won't solve a thing. ranting and venting about it to your friends will get it off your chest and possibly let you be able to move beyond the infection.

it is utter bullshit that she had to run away from her own journal because some people chose to attack. it's utter bullshit that people don't know enough to let people vent and heal on their own without making everything into some dramatic episode from dynasty. and, finally, it's utter bullshit that people are willing to throw stones in their own glass houses.

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

:) i love you, honey.

[foxant10.livejournal.com]

i love you too.

[paksenarrion2.livejournal.com]

*sigh* Guess I missed a whole boatload of crapola.

My thoughts-generally speaking since I don;t knwo who said what-I use my journal to rant-mainly about work. I was careful not to rant about OO, because I was afraid that some of it would get back to him. That being said, Cash has every right to rant, whatever in her journal. I am very upset that something that was said or done made her feel she had to delete it. It's one thing to disagree with someone's view points, but to attakc as has been said is wrong.

I know I would be pissed if my Boss or freinds of his came into my journal and gave me crap about what I had written-they are my feelings and are just as valid as anyone elses. *sigh*

Cash-if you are reading this *hugs* email/aim me iffen you need to talk. I have a broad shoulder for you to lean on/cry on or curse at.

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

*smooooch* paks. sorry you didn't feel like you could rant about OO in your journal. you should have felt perfectly safe expressing yourself in your own journal. if word got back to him, i say, who the fuck cares? he was an ass and deserved every bad thing you could have ever said about him. *hugs*

[kibarika.livejournal.com]

I'm not at the camp. I've inferred recently that there are reasons. Oh well. *hugs* to you. *hugs* to anthony (even though we are -mere- acquaintances...) *hugs* to Cash...

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

thanks kibs...*hugs*

[andeeh.livejournal.com]

OK, so I had this whole big comment typed out and deleted it, twice actually.I just can't find the right words to say what I want to, so I'm just going to say to Cashmere if she reads this {{{hugs}}}, love you and will always be here for you. As for those that brought about this situation I'll just go with what tiggz said, fucking people.

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

ack!! damn dingoes, andy!! *hugs*

[cornflakegirl23.livejournal.com]

I didn't know about a lot of this. I have a few problems with Camp, but for the most part, it's home. And I love the people there. Having said that, trashing anyone in their journal is appalling and I'm angry to hear that Cashmere felt she had to delete her LJ as a result of that. To treat someone like that in their private space is not acceptable, as I found out myself once when I was attacked in my journal. Tiggz, please send Cashmere huge *HUGS* from me. I hope she's OK.

Naomi/Seska
x

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

hopefully, she's reading this nay. *hugs* to you.

[bluefaerydaze.livejournal.com]

That is just horrible. I would hope Cash would not delete the lj, but make it where friends can read it. Or something to that sort. It's awful when someone cant even write their feelings.

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

*sigh* i know. i was hoping the same thing. *hugs* to you...

[cushla.livejournal.com]

She can still reclaim her journal though - maybe a little talking can encourage her to claim it?

And fucking people - I knew I read that wrong the first time...

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

yeah...she has thirty days to reclaim it.

lmao...you're so dirty cush. :?

[cushla.livejournal.com]

Well you know, it's true!

Re:

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

that you're dirty? yep! ;)

[chi2cali.livejournal.com]

Cush is dirty?

I am sorry Cush, there will only be clean people allowed to inhabit the same apartment building as me. *weg*

[chi2cali.livejournal.com]

I can't believe the nerve of some people. I don't know what happened. Nor will I ever understand, so maybe I shouldn't comment, but hey, restraint isn't my strong suit. What the hell gives people the right to think that they are superior to others? That just blows my mind.

People should have the right to post whatever they want to in their LJ. I do agree that making it public gives everyone the right to see it and even respond to it, however my beef is when people who seem to love to attack, belittle and just basically treat people like pond scum feel that it is there gift to God to spread the hate. I keep saying to myself, over and over again that if people want to act like that. So be it. Let them think that they have the "online" world at there fingerstips, because it is clearly obvious that they are faltering in the real world.

My comments here are about NO ONE in particular. I want to stress that. I didn't read what was said in Cashmeres journal. Neither her original post, or the comments about it. I just think that it boils down to common respect for other human beings and there opionions. I have friends whom I love more than life itself, who are friends with people I can't stand. It happens, Chris is right, Get over it. What are we, 2 years old?

This is THE reason why I don't post at either the Bronze or the Camp anymore.

I loved the Camp.

I still do.

I like the people there.

I love the Beta.

I still do.

I like the people there.

Do I post at any of these places anymore?

No.

Why? To tell you the truth, THIS is why. This whole "Negative energy" crap is the main reason. I don't need it, I have enough trouble on a day to day basis trying to keep upbeat and happy. I don't need people that I have never met bringing me down.

The internet started off as an escape from the every day for me, it started off as a place where I could come out of myself. Where the depression that Heather was feeling could escape inside Mia. This energetic, peppy, smiling, likes everyone kind of person. Slow but sure, Mia became part of Heather...now I can truly say they are one in the same. I like Heather. I like the person she is, and it makes me happy that others do to!

I will NEVER ever forget the people that I have met online. I have became friends, true friends, with these people. One of whom is my guardian angel (even though he will never read this). Then there are The Three who are my salvation, and who on a daily basis save me. Then there are countless others, whom I just can't imagine life without.

Will I come back to the Beta and Camp someday? I hope so...I want to always be able to come back. Right now I can't say I miss it. I do miss talking to some of the people. I was really starting to enjoy talking to and getting to know people. I cononected with some of them..I hope that connection will still be there should I decide to come back.

Cashemere, this post was for you, and it turned out being for me in the long run, and I am sorry for that. If you are reading this I am sorry you got hurt. No one deserves that. No one. I love you, and if you need me, I am right here.

Heather

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

that was a wonderful post, heath. i love you, girl! *smoooooch*

[chi2cali.livejournal.com]

I meant every word. I love you too my sweet Christy....

*hugs*

[cashmerepett.livejournal.com]

First, let me say thanks for the overwhelming support you guys have given me.

I will admit that I probably acted rashly when posting my rant about Allyson. I was starting to get sucked under by the huge wave of negativity that seems to be bogging down BOTH the beta AND the camp.

I guess Allyson, in what could be described as her typical posting style, started to personify that negativity to me. So I lashed out in my journal.


Cashmere says:
(Wed Apr 10 20:17:43 2002 209.176.95.2)

Allyson I think Spike hasn't been staked because he's an interesting character. It's well played. Good or Evil, he's fun to watch. A question, though...are you using Spike's character as a whipping post for your more generalized dissatisfaction with this season? Or has the site of his thin, pale chest driven you over the edge?

Allyson says:
(Wed Apr 10 21:07:51 2002 128.149.49.80)

Cashmere: I have sort of hypocritical view of Spike. I love the character for all its complexities, I do, and I have conflicting views on what the result should be within the BtVS framework. You want I should post my likely confusing view, or did you want a straight answer? My straight answer is, "Spike should have been staked long ago, and should be staked, soon, because he's a monster, capable of, and likely to, kill or otherwise harm the Scoobies."

But, to add to that, Spike also offers something this season as a whole lacks, which is some passion and at least SOMETHING to discuss. Grasping at grains of sand looking for water, so to speak.

Cashmere says:
(Wed Apr 10 21:18:25 2002 209.176.95.2)

Allyson That's IT! I TOTALLY agree with you on the dichotomy of the character! I'm ambivlent myself, so my own views are difficult to defend. I love the character--he's sexy and exciting, but EVIL!! Evil and compelling to watch. The only thing I can't agree with you on is the Spuffy-baiting...which is of course, your prerogative.

Allyson says:
(Wed Apr 10 22:34:58 2002 128.149.49.80)

Cashmere: Baiting would be me, saying to you, "Gee Cashmere, thanks for the holier than thou spanking."

Baiting Spuffists? Oh, that goes back to Crush. I'm following Fury's lead with, "Write love letters to serial killers, if you think Buffy is mean to Spike, he's rotten at the core." And I see people trying desperately to justify Spuffy, which is frightening, given that his love is based in stalking, in stealing panties, in, "love me or die." Bait them? No. I'm hurling anvils at them.


Now, TO ME, that seemed beyond snarky, into the realms of bitchy. And what I actually said was, "if Allyson wants to be a bitch, I won't stoop to her level."

For those that think I stepped over the line, OK, I understand your point. But, I wasn't about to let my journal turn into a threaded war over who's right and who's wrong.

Just for the record, I've always admired Allyson's balls. She had a caustic sense of humor and biting wit. That being said, I think those traits should be tempered by some compassion, some respect for other people, who's views you may not share, and who may not have your skills at expressing themselves.

If that makes me "holier than thou" *shrugs* I can't help that.

For those that suggested I should have kept my rant private, well, some of my (former?) friends were also friends of Allyson's, so it would not have prevented this. And I did not "go behind her back to call her a bitch". I stated my feelings publicly. How people can admire her blunt honesty, while begruding my right to rant in public is beyond me. I'm sure she's not losing sleep over what I think of her. I'm not losing sleep over what others might think of me. I stand by the integrity of my posts.

And as far as the camp, I do not paint all campers with the same wide brush. I found some witty and incredibly wonderful people to post with. However, in light of said events, I've pulled my registration there.

part II

[cashmerepett.livejournal.com]

cause they actually put a limit on how many words you can post!

I will also admit that I committed a huge breach of etiquette in posting the URL to the camp. Granted it was a little less than public, but I did it because I had pm'd vanessa about Vaal's interest in the camp, and when I wanted to give him the URL, hotmail went wonky and I went the lazy route of answering in LJ, which was breaking the rules I signed up for. Thanks, amberlynne for pointint that out. Which I immediately deleted when I got back home and realized my mistake.

That being said, I really can only add

Christy, I'm sorry to fill your journal with my raving, but you guys are especially who I wanted to express all these feelings to.

Ant, John, Mand, Heather, Andy and Christy. I can't say thank you enough. I love you guys.

Re: part II

[tiggz.livejournal.com]

lol...they really put a limit? that's interesting.

lisa you know i stand behind your right to say whatever you want in your own livejournal. whether or not you should have made the entry public or private is a moot point.

also, don't worry about putting this in my lj. i'm glad it's here. :)

*smoooooch* i love you too and you're welcome.